Chattanooga, TN pop rock band Nevertheless slowed things down a notch and got more serious for their sophomore release,
In The Making... Jesusfreakhideout.com sat down with the quintet in a middle school class room before a spot on
Fireflight's "Unbreakable Tour" to talk about the new album, Christian music, and what keeps them going on the road...
This interview took place on: 9/19/08.
Jesus freak Hideout (John DiBiase): Your new album, In The Making..., is definitely
a stylistic and even thematic shift from your debut. How did these changes come about?
I think it came about pretty naturally. We actually did 8 or 9 demos back in October of last year. It was very
similar to Live Like We're Alive musically, and even lyrically it was kind of more similar.
And we had a couple guys at our label who said, "Let's just go and record this and put it out." And then we had
a couple of guys who were like, "Let's keep on writing and see how we progress." At the time, we were all, "No, man,
this is pretty much the record. These are the songs we want." But we kept writing at the label's request, of course,
and it kind of shifted from a really, really energetic pop rock record - even though there are a couple tracks like that -
into more of a thoughtful thing. And we realized that the songs on the first record that people really loved the most were
songs like "Lover," "O Child," and kind of the more intimate moments and the more spiritual lyrics as opposed to some of the
songs that are just more fun that we were writing. We just really concentrated on shifting that way with the whole new batch of
songs we wrote this year.
Piano is natural, too. I mean, you hear it on our EP, From The Inside Looking In, which had hints of piano in it.
When we were writing on the road, we would usually go to a piano behind stage and have a guitar with us and mess around
with the melody, and we were like, "Hey, this actually sounds really cool with the piano." So that was just a natural thing, too.
We wanted to bring it more in. It was probably six months after Live Like We're Alive was recorded, probably, that
we wished we did more piano the first time. So it was one of the things we always wanted to do in the first place and just
kind of thought out the vision a little more this time, as far as piano goes. It ended up being more piano than we
thought this time.
JFH (John): How was it working with a different producer for the new record?
It was great. It was a different experience altogether. The first time, we lived in Florida for two months straight and did the record.
And this record we did in what?
Twenty three days! *laughs*
Twenty three days. So we flew through it, but there's probably a huge difference between producers.
James Wisner was kind of a really analytical computer guy and Rob Hawkins... the new record's probably, believe it or not,
a little dirtier in parts as far as tracking. So Rob was way more laid back. You kind of hear it on the record, but to me,
it's more enjoyable that way. It's not as mechanical.
Yeah. We didn't really try hard, y'know? *Josh laughs* I know that sounds bad, but we wrote for eight months,
just hashing out, over thinking, trying to figure out what our second record was gonna be, as opposed to being like,
"What do we do best? What have we noticed during our live show that we can connect with." And it was songs like "O Child,"
"Lover" - it was more of that. Not that we wanted to completely detach ourselves from the more pop rock, a little bit of
the pop punk influence, but we definitely wanted to steer more in that direction, y'know? Have more "moments" on this album.
We're pretty much softies at heart, really. We listen to Cold Play, piano-based stuff like Jack's Mannequin,
stuff like that. The Rocket Summer. Those heart songs, y'know? Their slow hits really influenced us to dabble into that
a little more.
JFH (John): Yeah, I could tell. It kind of reminded me more of your indie EP.
Mmmhmm, yeah, that's what people say.
JFH (John): Yeah, it seemed like before the labels or a producer got their hands on you - that was
more of who Nevertheless is.
That was actually our goal the whole time, to just simplify it, y'know? Not in a way where it would be like, "let's just get
to the part and do it and move on," but we'd have four guitar parts, cool little candy parts, and at the end of the day,
we'd ask ourselves "Did this actually help make that?" And we'd say, "No, it really didn't..." and we'd take it out and still
love it and that core part is still there. There's still stacked strings - there's still a lot of stuff that makes it full that
we used this time as opposed to just stacking six guitar parts the first time, that we can't do live. *laughs*
It was easier with the first record because it was more energetic - musically, it was easier to do it. With the slower songs,
they're more vulnerable, so we tried to find new ways to fill it out.
JFH (John): Did you find it difficult writing more vulnerable and open on this record?
At first, I think so.
Yeah, at first. With the first batch of demos we wrote last Fall, a lot of those songs were shallower themes about being on
the road and missing people back home and stuff like that. But I really feel like God took us through kind of a transformation.
We were home a lot in January and February and then we went into the studio in March, and when we were home, we got plugged
back into our churches, cuz a lot of times, we travel on Sundays, and we got plugged back into our churches and families and
really got to rest. There are a couple of songs, one actually called "Rest," that talk about resting and I really feel like that's
where the songs came from - the more intimate, more thoughtful songs. When we wrote that first batch of demos, we were just
tired. We were on the road and all these songs were talking about being on the road and being tired.
Being in a van. *laughs* How can a kid relate to being in a van, y'know? Only a small percentage. *laughs*
Josh: It really came naturally. We can even see - we looked at some photos from last Fall that we took
and then looked through some photos from the beginning of this year. I think we even looked healthier. So I think a lot of the
songs came out of that place of rest and really finding peace with God.
JFH (John): What's the story behind "Cross My Heart?"
Josh: We were in between writing songs for the new record and when you're doing a record, there are
a lot of voices. A lot of people are putting their hands on it, saying, "Do it this way and do it this way" and there's a line
in the song that people are always asking what it means that says "Your helping hands are more like suicide" and it's
not a literal suicide. It's like death to your art. So that song kind of came out of frustration that people were just trying
to kill your art and make it just this "Christian radio friendly," glazed-over, whatever. And, honestly, we were just really
frustrated and I wrote the lyrics in one sitting, sent it to our label and our A&R guy listened to it
and he said, "This is about the record industry, isn't it?" And I was like... "I don't know?" *laughter*
It's actually really cool because it's one of Blaine in A&R's favorite songs on the record. He's like, "I love 'Cross
My Heart!'" I think one day he said, "I can't help but think it's about me?" *laughter* But it was amazing, he just
went with it. I love the honesty. He thinks it's real honest. And you can't really argue with that, y'know? The honesty in it.
Yes, it was a frustration that we were going through at the time, but we learned even through that that it actually turned into
an amazing partnership at the end of it. The label - everybody's happy, we're really happy with them pushing us in that
direction, obviously. And the other thing is, as far as speaking to people in different ways, a lot of people take it as peer
pressure. And that's exactly what it falls under. You can take that song and run with it as far as, in today's generation,
being pressured into stuff they go through. They're like, "Man, that's helping me!" So it's cool.
Honesty makes a difference!
Josh: The bridge at the very end was the last thing we wrote. It's talking to God, saying, "You
make all things new," and what we realized at the end of the day was, assuming people that we work with in the industry are believers
and we're believers, and assuming God is making our hearts new daily, then you can always find a compromise, you can always
find brotherhood and a common ground, so hopefully that's the point of the song. And the funny thing is, actually, I kind of
fought against it being on the record at first. Because I didn't want to look like we were angry or anything. *laughs*
And I said, "Are you sure you want to put it on the record?" Blaine was like, "Yeah! I want it." And I said,
"...We have other songs we can put on the record!"
*laughs* Well you know how bands get. It's easy to be like, "Man, this our thing!" We didn't want to come across like
that. But he loved it and he ran with it.
It's on the record! *laughs*
JFH (John): How about the song, "I Needed This"?
That's a funny story, too.
Yeah, we actually wrote that for the first record, Live Like We're Alive, so it's the oldest song
on the record. At that time, we had just signed with Provident and Flicker and we were going through a lot of different
changes and hopefully it doesn't sound shallow, but that song back then was kind of similar to "Cross My Heart." Those are
the two that kind of group together on the record, for me. Cuz we kind of had a lot more hands in the pot and
we were seeing some of the things - like some of the liberties and freedoms of being an indie band - being taken
away from us, but it turned out better in the end. And that's when we wrote that song. We said, "Y'know what? God knows
what we need to sharpen us" and that's why it says, "I needed this all along." It says, "You'll never hear me
say that I wanted it this way, but I needed this all along" and that song just kind of laid dead for about a year
and a half. Our A&R, Blaine, when we were picking songs for the record, said, "What about that 'I Needed This' song you
wrote a couple years ago?" And we all listened to it again and then just added our new spin on it and everyone liked it,
so we put it on the record.
AJ: It's almost like we needed a way for it to actually be more fitting. Like, we went through a year
and a half of touring and all kinds of craziness and personal stuff going on and ups and downs and then, at the end of the day,
we needed this all along -- what God has brought us to. So it's kind of cool that we waited, and it fit right in with what
we were going through at the moment.
JFH (John): While I understand how mind boggling the things that inspired you to
write "Topics" are, what finally made you sit down and write it and what do you hope the song might do?
Josh: Man, that's actually, so far, the song that's getting the most talk. What made us write it,
actually, was just the interaction with kids at shows. When we first started touring, we had no idea that kids would
just spill their guts to us. Kids would even say statements like, "Nobody knows about this. My parents don't know, my
youth pastor doesn't know, 'so and so' doesn't know - but I'm addicted to drugs." And you're like the only person they've told!
We just realized that kids often don't feel close enough to their parents or their youth pastors to really
open up and be vulnerable. And I think, a lot of times, that's because we don't understand grace. I don't want to get off
topic too much, but I think if you understand grace and how everyone needs God, no matter who you are, then you'll understand
where these kids are coming from. I think, sometimes, adults who have been out of adolescence for a long time now can become
kind of insensitive to it and don't identify with these people. And that's why it says, "We avoid the topics" and then
it says, "We make the kids have secrets," because that's what we make them do, y'know? If they're not telling anyone,
they're just holding it inside. And it can eat you alive. I like the bridge the best, it's a prayer to God, "You gotta
save us. We hide behind faces that we make to disguise the things we're ashamed of." I'm not saying to tell everyone on
national television your laundry, but we should have a group - people that are older than us - always, that we can go to
and ask for wisdom and help. It's kind of my prayer and our prayer. And really, the song just came naturally. We were
at a show, AJ and I were just messing around with stuff (musically) and the lyrics just came very naturally as a result of
talking with kids. So we wrote that probably about a year and a half ago. It's probably the second oldest song on the record.
AJ: I think just another reason why we wrote that was because of realizing, "Hey, a kid comes up and spills his
guts to me, I'm gonna be gone in three hours," y'know? There's only so much we can say and do. It's more of a wake-up
call to the community in the church to be aware of it. Start breaking down these walls so people can be honest.
JFH (John): What inspired "Longshot?"
Josh: "Longshot" is the funnest song on the record. It was in Franklin, TN, and AJ had this guitar part.
And man, I just thought about all the times I was in youth group and there's always that girl you want to talk to, y'know?
And you have all these things in your head you want say and you don't know what to say?
It's the most lighthearted song on the record. It's kind of giving a voice to those kids. I had a guy come up to me the other
day and I said, "What's up man?" and he said, "Dude, I want to tell you what song on your record really, really encouraged me."
And I'm thinking it's going to be "Rest" or something like that. And he's like, "Longshot!" *laughter*
And I'm like, "Are you serious? How?!" And he said, "Man, that's exactly how I'm feeling. Like, I want to talk to this girl
and I have all these things I want to say to her, but I don't know what to say." And we just figured, man, you gotta have
one song on the record like that that's just fun.
AJ: It's a pretty heavy record and there was a moment where we were wondering if it even fit.
But I'm so glad we did it. It's definitely a refreshing break from any heavy topic, just having a good time.
JFH (John): What's that part where there's talking in the background?
Josh: *AJ laughs* Dude. That's funny, actually, we did that last minute. Was it like 2
in the morning or something?
AJ: Yeah, we were in the studio finishing background vocals and Rob said, "Get in there. This sounds like a party. Let's
just have a party." And we were just acting stupid into the mic and he kept everything. And Josh was like *makes
silly monkey-like sounds* And he says something like - if you listen closely - "Rob Hawkins? That guy doesn't know
what he's talking about!" or something like that. *laughs*
JFH (John): All I could make out was "Nevertheless"
Josh: I said, "Neverthe-WHAT?!" *laughter* It's in the track, in the back. And they decided
to keep it on the record.
AJ: You do even the little like monkey singing til the end.
Adam Rowe: It doesn't even sound human either, sounds like a synth or something.
AJ: I remember the conversation. We sat down the next day and were like... "Guys... we have 'Topics' on
the record and then like..." *laughs*
Josh: It's almost like you sinned or something. It was like the next day we came in, it was almost
like conviction. You were like, "Dude, I don't know if we should have done that last track." *laughter*
"Maybe we should take all those tracks off!"
AJ: *laughing* Like all these heavy topics and then "Whoa-AH-AH-oh-oh!" It was perfect though, it
JFH (John): Can you tell the story behind "I Found My Way Back Again"? And is there
a guest vocalist at the end?
Josh: *AJ raises his hand* AJ sings that part on that and then he sings the second verse of
"It's No Secret." That's his voice as well.
JFH (John): You should sing more often. You're so much better than Josh
*laughter* I'm prepping him before I leave the band *joking* Trying to work him in. ... "I Found My Way Back Again"...
I'm not sure how much detail to go into. I had a friend call me one time who was at a really, really low point and actually
kind of suicidal. He said, "Nobody loves me," and we kind of hashed that out. And I said, "Your family loves you," and he
explained to me that his Dad had been gone since he was a kid, his brother was in jail, and his mom was never around, y'know,
this and that. It was a really, really hard conversation and I don't know if he is a believer or not, but he says he's a believer...
I don't know. So I told him, "I really believe that God loves you," and he said, "I can't feel that and I don't know that."
And I said, "Maybe you can't reach over and physically touch him, but imagine that you have this door and you just locked it.
And God, this whole time, your whole life, has maybe been showing you you can't do this alone and now you're at this point of
depression and He's still saying you can't do this alone." And that's why, at the end of the song, it says, "Let Him in,
let Him in." And the rest of the song up until that point is kind of depressing. It's the story about this guy who's down
and out. And it even says, "This little Hell," because sometimes, if you're under the control of Satan, it is like a little
Hell, y'know? And you're at this really low point. We wanted to end the record like that and end the whole record with the words
"Let Him in," because that's the main thing, and that's the main thing for us. There's going to be real high points
in your life, but there's also going to be really low points. In both scenarios, God is at the door saying, "Let Me in. You need
Me in the good times and you need Me in the bad times as well." So the lyrics were kind of inspired by that story. But also,
we tried not to be too specific because it's inspired by all of our stories. It's inspired by depravity and our need for God.
JFH (John): Is there a specific song on the record that means the most to each of you guys?
Josh: I have a favorite. My favorite one is "It's True." I think that's the most definitive song
on the record. Personally, I think that. Just because it says, "It's true, I believe in You. We've made it hard to see the light
through the things we do." Cuz people get that mixed up. People get the sometimes flawed actions of Christians
mixed up with a Holy God and a perfect God. And I don't think we can mix that up. So, to me, that's my favorite line on the whole
record. It's just so definitive and I think it's true.
Adam Rowe: My favorite changes all the time. And that's probably my favorite characteristic of the record -
that I can listen to it everyday and find a different favorite one. But, I guess right now, my favorite is "Augustine."
I feel like it just takes you for a ride. At the end, you feel like you watched a movie or something. *laughter*
AJ: It definitely paints a picture, yeah.
Adam Wann: Yeah, as a musician, it's my favorite song musically. I don't have any say in lyrics or whatever,
but the music - it was cool to think about something and try to recreate it with a guitar or make it give different emotions
musically, instead of trying to make emotion with the lyrics.
AJ: That was probably the one song on the record that we tried to paint a picture with the music as well
as the lyrics and they intertwine. The strings are real washy and the chorus says, "Love is an ocean caught in a storm,"
and the guitar parts are just slide guitar parts. It was fun to see that come together.
Brad Jones: Favorite to play live is "Longshot," just cuz it's fun. I don't know, like message-wise and stuff,
I remember back when writing the songs for the record -- of course, I don't write the lyrics or anything, but -- I remember
"Topics" as well, because I guess I had kind of a small connection with it. I was one of those kids back when I was younger
who didn't really feel that I couldn't really open up to anybody, so I thought that was kind of cool. Hearing the song, I knew that
there were kids out there that needed to hear that. I think it's a really good message and I think there's tons of people that
can relate. So it was always something that I insisted, "You gotta keep that song." I remember back doing demos, because I would
do these rough acoustic demos in my house for the two of them, and they weren't wanting to demo the song for the longest time.
I actually had to force them to demo that song. I was like, "I want a copy of it. If it never makes it to an album,
I at least want a copy of it." So I kind of got them to demo it once and everyone kind of started liking it after that.
AJ: Man, Adam and I were talking about the record in general. It was almost like we kind of had to do it
this way. We definitely slowed it down. Even the lyrics are thicker. They're heavy. It's one of those albums you kind of
gotta spend some time with. You can't just pop it in on a sunny day and listen to "Topics." *laughs*
It's a little more of a mood kind of thing. But I really feel like, honestly, God wanted us to make the record like that.
Cuz, man, I tell ya, we love rocking out - that's all we listen to. Right now, our favorite record is Academy Is. It's a band
that just released a record and it's that power pop, just happy, fast-driven songs. Maybe the next record we'll lean
more towards that again. But it was one of those things where, in this moment, it's just definitely a better picture of what
we're going through and stuff we could pull from, lyrically, from the experiences and stories that we had.
JFH (John): What are your thoughts on the whole idea of Christian music as a separate industry?
Josh: I think it can work as a great filter. First of all, I think you can't say "Christian" is a genre.
We've told people we're in a "Christian band" and they're like, "Oh, so you sound like Steven Curtis Chapman?" And we're like,
"...No, it's a rock band." And they're like, "Oh, so you're in a 'rock band,' not a 'Christian band.'" And we'd say, "Well, no.
We're Christians, but it's a rock band." *AJ laughs* And they're like, "Well, what are you like? Steven Curtis Chapman?
Or Led Zeppelin?" *laughs* Y'know? Some people don't understand. It can serve as a great filter as far as screening
music and things, but I think it can also be dangerous because a lot of parents will say "Here, listen to this." And, how do
I know that every Christian artist under the sun is saying the right things and saying Biblical things. So I think you still have
to be active in engaging any kind of entertainment in any kind of music - same as movies, all that kind of stuff.
I don't know. I don't know how to answer that as far as the industry goes. I understand wanting to break down walls as well,
cuz one of my pet peeves is keeping everything in a bubble and being scared of the outside world, because I know that we're
called to go out into the world as well, y'know? Some of my favorite parts about our shows are not necessarily on
stage, but after the show - like we were talking about "Topics," some of these kids may be just lost and don't even know Christ.
And they need that from a band. If they can get that from us instead of some mainstream band, we're more than happy to give that
to them. So, I don't know...
Adam Rowe: I think there are two sides of it. I think the Christian industry gives a good place for Christian
music to grow and to build. I'm trying to think if I were a parent who was raising a Christian family, it'd be hard to filter
the radio where there's like Marilyn Manson and then there's Switchfoot, and then there's... you'd say, "Well, just don't listen
to that station," so that's kind of hard, but on the other side of it, being an artist, sometimes you feel restrictions to stay
within certain artistic parameters...
Josh: Well, if we're just being straight-up honest - even radio, like when you're making a record,
because they have to sell records, people say, "Well, if this isn't spiritual enough of a song, radio's probably not gonna
play it." I'm like, "Well, it is spiritual, listen to it deeper. We're all Christian men writing these songs, just
go back and listen to it." People call it "The Jesus Meter" - JPMs, how many times can you say "Jesus" in the song to put it on
the radio. And, to me, I'd rather sing a song like "Longshot," that's kind of fun and about a relationship, than see how many
times I could fit the name "Jesus" into a song. Because if it's not from my heart, y'know, I believe it's in vain.
AJ: I was talking to a radio guy and it kind of opened my eyes. He was so
straight-up and practical about it, but he was like, "The reason why people started making Christian radio stations
is because when Christian rock started getting big, if you'd send it to a mainstream station, they wouldn't play it.
They were like, 'No, we're not going to play this, this is offensive.' So, in a practical way, they almost had to [start
their own station to] get it out there. That's how Christian radio started, I think. Don't you agree?" I was like, "Oh! That's
true. They probably wouldn't let you play it, so you had to start your own station!" *laughs* And then it did
grow. I honestly believe Christian music is more accepted [now]. People are more open to it. It's definitely in the past
five years, I hate to say it and it sounds kind of cheesy, but it's got a lot of cred, y'know? Bands have gotten out there
and really worked hard, through grassroots marketing and put their music out there. Like Switchfoot has really broken through.
There are bands like that that have really done it and people are like, "Man, this is awesome!" When P.O.D. broke out, that
really made people open to Christian music. I think it's still a good thing, but I guess there's still that two-sided
thing that you can be on in whatever mood you're in. Like, whatever mood you're in, you could say one thing and be frustrated
one day and be like, "Man, I just truly want to write from my heart!" and, like [Adam] was saying, people are making me feel
restricted, even sound-wise! I definitely believe Christian music shouldn't have a certain sound.
JFH (John): I agree, totally. And that's the thing that's frustrating for us, because we'll
get a record and listen to it and be like, "This is SO made for radio." Like, I wonder what the band really wants to
sound like? And I felt like, with the new Nevertheless record, that this was more "This is what we wanted to do." and it's
honest, y'know? But there are some songs you hear on the radio and you're thinking, "This sounds so fabricated!" You can predict
the next part of the song. You can even predict some of the lyrics. And it's hard for us because we don't want that to be
"Christian music," y'know? We want to encourage the Christian industry to think outside the box, to be more creative.
We're the children of God, WE should be making the music that the mainstream is trying to copy!
AJ: Honestly, if we all just ban together and just be true artists, y'know? Probably, you would
see "Christian bands" being like, "Yeah! We're a 'Christian band!'" *laughs* Y'know? But now, it's not like that.
Josh: It'd be awesome if we treated it like a brotherhood - we're all brothers and sisters in Christ
and we're all family together, and we all live from the inside out with our hearts, and maybe this is like a utopia or
something - but if that could happen, like you said, we'd be proud and be like, "Yeah, we're all in Christian bands here!"
Now, it's like, "Yeah, we are, but we don't sound like that!"
AJ: To me, that's probably just the problem. Like, musically and lyrically. People are just trying to stick
with what works and it did probably work at one time, but now it kind of has fallen behind the curve, y'know?
JFH (John): And the worst part is the music industry as a whole is hurting so bad with
sales that they're trying to find whatever's going to sell and then get behind that.
AJ: Maybe that's going to help. I know it's definitely more of a desperate time, musically. Maybe people
are going to be more open and just try something?
JFH (John): What music have you been listening to a lot lately?
Josh: Favorite record of the year is probably Cold Play. Just love it - creatively, musically, everything,
just love it. That's more of a musical thing. Another record, spiritually, is Leeland's Opposite Way. That
SONG "Opposite Way" is probably one of the best songs I've ever heard.
AJ: Leeland's a good example, man, of what we were talking about.
JFH (John): I love that song. I would buy that record just for that song.
Josh: Yeah, totally! To me, Leeland's a band that is living inside out with their writing. You can tell that's
just what they want to write, y'know?
Adam Rowe: I love this question but I also hate it cuz whenever they ask ya, [my mind's] just POOF, gone. *laughter*
Musically, I think one of my favorite, favorite records that came out recently is the new Augustana record. I just can't stop
listening to it. But, lyrically, I don't want to copy Josh, but Leeland just rocks my socks off. It's just so good.
Brad: The new Tenth Avenue North CD...
AJ: Yeah, I was just about to say Tenth Ave.
Brad: I don't want to put them in that Leeland thing, but he's really coming along as the next little Leeland.
*laughter* He's probably actually the same age, I don't know!
AJ: No, he's like nine years older! How old is he...?
Brad: Well as far as musical career goes or whatever, but there's a couple of songs on that CD that are
just really amazing. But musically, I listen to all sorts. Like, I guess that's my lyrical point since everyone's doing
lyrical music. I like listening to all kinds of random stuff. I know Death Cab For Cutie just came out with a CD not too
long ago that's pretty awesome. It actually sounds more like their really old stuff.
Adam Wann: Lately, I've been having a hard time, I don't know, I guess cuz we just got done doing a record.
I was listening to a lot of stuff before then. I've just kind of plateaued on that, I hadn't really found anything that
I wanted to listen to other than that. I don't know, I literally haven't put my iPod on in months.
Josh: You swore off music. *laughs*
Adam Wann: I almost have, cuz - and this is really being blunt - I can't really find anything that makes
me happy, musically. I listen to the same things I listened to the last few tours -- Lovedrug, Copeland, The Working Title.
I listen to a lot of bands that influence me musically. I always listen to those, I guess.
AJ: Over the summer, after Josh bought it, I got into Tom Petty's Greatest Hits. *laughter*
I loved that. We were home a lot in the summer and I'd drive around town, just roll down the windows, listen to Tom Petty. It
JFH (John): What has God been teaching you guys, lately?
Josh: A lot. A lot, a lot. Recently, this is going to sound crazy, but we have gotten back into the idea
of spiritually encouraging one another. I know that sounds crazy because you should always do that, but it's kind of like - you
start the band, and every aspect is there: the musical aspect and this and this, and there's a spiritual aspect, when you pray
together. And we've always prayed together before the shows, that's one thing, but when business gets in the way sometimes,
it becomes a job and you kind of keep your job here and your other things here. And recently, we realized that we have to
merge those once again and we're not just coworkers, but we're brothers in Christ. Actually, we brought our road manager
out, Bryant. Bryant got us this really cool book called The Man That God Uses by Henry Blackaby, and before every show,
somebody leads a discussion and we go through this book together, and we're seeing the band grow closer to each other and
closer to God through that. Because there was a period probably 6 months or a year ago when we still prayed before the show just
because it was like a routine. But we weren't really purposely spiritually encouraging each other, cuz you have to do that, y'know?
Adam Wann: What's cool about the book is [Blackaby] takes a topic and he'll tell you something just to get
the ball rolling. Like "faithfulness," we had that yesterday and it kind of asks this question and says something about it
and at the end, we're all putting our personal things into it so we connect better. Like, I don't know Henry (the author),
but we all put ourselves into it and then the next thing you know, it's actually being very beneficial.
Brad: It's kind of a conversation starter.
AJ: We definitely needed it. We were getting really burned out, almost to the point where - it was so
blunt and honest, but I almost felt like being in the band was bringing me down sometimes. Because you have to have
that community. When you're around four other guys 24/7 and you're not doing that, it will bring you down -- to be around
anything. To be by yourself and not do anything. It's the same exact thing. It's been amazing. We've really gotten
to that point where we look at it like a discipline thing. We're moving forward and you can see a difference for sure.
Josh: I have a really good friend who lives in Minneapolis, MN and we were all hanging out after Sonshine Fest
and we went to St. Paul and we went to this huge Catholic church and we were sitting outside on these benches and
talking, it was probably 10 or 11 at night. And I remember how he kept wanting to bring up spiritual topics - this was not too
long ago at all - and I was so tired and I was like, "Yeah... yeah, that is cool... So what do you want to eat?" or something.
And I remember he put his hand on my shoulder and he said, "Dude, if we're going to be friends, we've got to purposely talk
about spiritual things with each other." And it was one of those things that hits you, y'know? And it's mildly offensive that
somebody would say that to you, but it's true. It's so true. If you're going to be Christian friends, you need to purposely
talk about the Word of God and topics like that. You can't assume all that stuff's taken care of and blow it off.
(Left to right: Adam Wann, AJ Cheek, Josh Pearson, Brad Jones, Adam Rowe)